#14 Nick Greene Ralph Gracie San Francisco

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Welcome back to another episode of Luckee's podcast, where stories of grit, growth, and transformation takes center stage. Today's guest is someone whose life journey weaves through continents, careers, and countless jiu jitsu mats. Meet Nick born in Seoul South Korea adopted at 18 months by an Irish father and a Jewish mother, and raised on the East Coast before planting roots in the Bay Area. Nick's pass hasn't been easy navigating a complicated family dynamic, identifying as an Asian adoptee and the challenges of growing up as an outsider. But from early days of break dancing and running track to study neurobiology at UC Davis and becoming a police officer, to now living and breathing Brazilian jiu jitsu. Nick's story is nothing short of dynamic. We talk about personal evolution, what it means to be grounded, to examine your past and to find peace through motion, whether it's flying through the air paragliding, floating in the flow of a role or reconnecting with his Korean roots after decades. Nick has lived through chapters that many of us only read about, stick around as we deep dive into his journey of self discovery, resilience, and the surprising ways community shows up when you least expect it. So let's get started from the beginning. Nick, what do you remember about your early childhood or the stories you've been told about your adoption? Yeah, Renee, thanks for the introduction and, thanks for having me here. I'd say early childhood, I would, I'd say it's very vanilla. I grew up in Massachusetts, in Connecticut, so I was in Massachusetts in a small town where there's like a church every few blocks from age one and a half to five. Pretty vanilla if you will. And then Connecticut was the same. I remember, it's very homogenous. So it was like probably 90% Caucasian. I just think about that because when we moved out, my family moved out to California when I was 10. I grew up in the Bay Area there, and it's just really diverse. You know, um, just meet people of different ethnicities and cultures, so it stood out. Okay. What was it like, growing up over there? What did you do as a child? In the East Coast or in the East Coast? East Coast. Let's start there. I think I did soccer. My dad was like pretty involved with my life sports wise. So I did AYSO soccer. It was more like a really, an outdoor kid biked a lot. And, it was pretty simple times then. I didn't really get into like more like hobbies that I was really into until maybe like middle school, high school. Okay. What was it like growing up as a Korean adoptee in a white household on the east coast? So my parents were really good about being colorblind, quote unquote, they never made me feel any different. they treated me like, a like a blood son, So internally in the household it was fine. I think a lot of Asian adolescents run into this in the United States where, you know, because they're different, they get called names or, they can be a little bit ostracized. Yeah. I just remember. I think it was like elementary school some kid called me a flat face. I got called a gook. And then, getting angry or, like that, triggering me. It would lead to a fight. The funny thing also is that I did an adoptee related podcast and it was a live podcast with like maybe 80 or 90 adoptees in the room in the audience. And then when I shared the story I'm sharing with you now, I said everybody, if anyone's had any type of experience like that, raise your hand. And there is 15 or 20 people that raise their hand. So Oh yeah. It's a thing. It's a thing that we have to like navigate but that was when I was really young. Yeah, I can imagine. Yeah. Do you know anything about your biological family or where you came from, or the adoption agency. Yeah. These, great questions. So I went through Holt Adoption Agency. They're a really major one that did a lot of adoptions in South Korea. there's a few of'em. There's like Eastern Society, Social Welfare, KSS. And for myself, there really wasn't much on my file. I think there was a note. Apparently I was found on like a fancy apartment complex with a note. Like in a basket that said mom and dad can take care of him. Please find him a good home. and that was basically all the information I had. So a lot of adoptees end up trying to find their birth family. And there's, you know, basically you can do, 23 and me, you can go through the agency and then see what they have on records. So I did what most adoptees do is you go to Korea, you go to the agency, you do a file request to look up like what's on file. And some of them there is stuff on their file, some of them there isn't. There really wasn't any additional information on mine. I did a search though. I went with a volunteer. We went to my home city. There's different methods to like, cast your net to try and find your birth family, right? So I basically did as much as you could and didn't really yield too much results. And then, it, this could go to a very different tangent, but basically there, there's a huge issue now with, falsification of records with adoption agencies. Currently there's a truth and reconciliation committee. Which is part of, the Korean government, which is doing like an investigation into this. So this is like actually going on right now. Oh, wow. That's great. The adoptee community, which, is pretty large in and of itself. Like everyone's watching and seeing what happens. That's going on right now. Oh, okay. Yeah. We'll get into that later. Yeah. Yeah, sure. But I'm really glad that they're doing something about it. Yeah. Yeah. It's fingers crossed. How would you describe your relationship with your dad growing up? Yeah. I think, my dad, I was pretty fortunate. I think my father had a lot of traits that make for a good father. He was involved in sports. He spent a lot of good quality time with me. I actually remember I got into jogging'cause of him, like when we were, when I was in high school, we used to jog together. When he was, when he got off of work. He is like a big supporter of me as a person. There's like little things like you remember when you're young. So when I was in middle school, he used to take me to the comic book shop and he'd give me like$20 like every other week or something. It was basically to encourage me to, read. I wasn't a big reader, so by doing comics, like he's like, oh, Nick will read more. Right? But it's more picture, you know, like I'm more into the comics and the pictures. But yeah, it was him encouraging me to, I guess get into my creative side. So yeah, he was always a big supporter of what he did. And also like he was a person, not of many words. So I remember we go jogging. I'd ask him like, all these questions on life, like, how should I save? And, do you have any advice for careers? And what I wanna be when I grow up? And he didn't really say much, he just, but what I like is he kept it open. He was just like, whatever you do, I support you. Whereas I feel like some fathers, they might be like, I'm a lawyer, so you have to be a lawyer or something like that. Driving you to be what they want you to be or what they wanna create you to be. Exactly. Or projecting. So he was really good about just like letting me find my own path. Being supportive. And at the time I was like, oh, I want him to give more guidance, but in a way I'm like, he did. He just, he's like, forge your path and I'm here to help you however he can. Wow. He sounds like amazing dad. He's a good guy. Yeah. Good. Awesome. You mentioned your mom had struggles with addiction. How did that shape your childhood or the way you saw the world? Yeah, so it's a tough one'cause I talked to my dad about this, but I also wanna respect his boundaries'cause it's like he's his own person and it's like the more I complained to him or you know, like my issues with my adoptive mother, it's not fair to him. I think that's just something on my mind of like where I'm at now. But to that anyways, background on my mother. She's a very loving person. there are a lot of good warm traits about hers, but I think that she's plagued by like certain issues with substance abuse, alcohol abuse. And it's tough because, it compounds over time like, and it's debilitating where it's like, I could still remember in maybe middle school where, she'd hide it, she'd drink, she just not really take care of herself. She also lacked as a caregiver, like a very functional, statement of what a caregiver provides. And, I think it just got worse over time. And it's like anything with any of us where it's if you don't, if you don't really understand how to regulate yourself with addiction, it can really get the best of you. And, like honestly, I've had, phases in my life where, I've allowed for certain addictive traits of mine to have too much control over myself in my life. And it's been that regulatory, like, how do I catch that and what do I do about that? But for my adoptive mother is tough because, not to get in too much detail, but she, there is once or twice where, there's alcohol poisoning or maybe too many substances where, you know, like ambulance was involved. I remember I think when I was 12, I think it was like middle school, like I found her like on the floor, like with vomit in her mouth, passed out. So it's like, you know, you'd clear her airway and then call the ambulance, right? I think, being at that age is tough. Most children shouldn't really have to do that. Yeah, they shouldn't have to deal with, situations like that. That's pretty grown up, situation to be in. Yeah. So I think, on the topic with estrangement, it is been challenging because like I've, you know, like it's not overnight. It's like I've tried to maintain relations with her and make it work, and it's just like a rollercoaster gun. Like it's. It worked, but not really worked. And then, she followed into patterns again. And then it just, it is actually really detrimental on myself because it's like we try and compensate for that and make it like, make the relationship work. And I remember, there was like a Thanksgiving where like, you know, it's a podcast I know this is public domain. She made a Turkey. I think my father did a lot of the other work for the other, like parts of the Thanksgiving dinner. And, she's drinking and I'm not quite sure what else. And, she collapsed on the floor. She was like, the Turkey fell on the ground and I think it was like, it was probably like a combination of like pills and alcohol. We had to carry her into bed and the odd thing is that's not the first time. So I think like at some point I'm like, I can't do this anymore. Right? I had to make a conscious decision to estrange myself from her. Right? the bigger challenge is that, like my, I'm trying to, I. My father wants us to get along and I'm trying to tell him like, this isn't normal and he understands it's not normal. But he still wants us to like, like everyone wants like a happy ending. I'm like, well, the reality is like not everyone gets along and not everything works out that way, Yeah. Do you think there was some, traumatic experience that your mom fell into this? Did she have a family? that was the same way? do you think? Yeah. you're basically touching on generational trauma. Yeah. Which is like carrying on traumatic and, passing it on. I'm not quite so one, She doesn't really talk about her family much. She's from a Jewish household. There's trauma from Jewish people from, world War I, and II, and other factors. she was the youngest, of all her siblings. There's that sort of younger complex of like the runt of the group. And like apparently her older brothers. Like there's physical and then there's the topic of emotional abuse. There wasn't any physical abuse, it sounds like there's emotional abuse. I just don't know to what degree. I also sense that, when she's growing up, she probably didn't learn how to express our emotions well, which is like anger is anger's a tool, right? It's not just like emotions have a purpose, like, for crying or basically there's supposed to be like four core emotions, like fear, anger, sadness, I forgot the other, I dunno why I'm blanking. It's all right. But the all serve a purpose, right? there's a tool like, they're not just. To be there. To be there. And I think that she never really exercised them. So what happens is if you don't really address your issues or take accountability for yourself, you, it's escapism and you just continue to escape from things. Yeah, it's a tough one, I'll just simply put, I don't think she wants to do the work of trying to do internal work. Whereas like everyone should, I should. Yeah. And I don't think that she has the tools to do it. Okay. So that kinda makes sense. Okay. Yeah. You talked about your father, hiking and he did some pretty amazing things. Do you want to talk about that? Sure. Yeah. It, he's a really. Fascinating guy. So he studied, he's a physics PhD. He's a super nerd. I think, some other things about him, there's a period where he would read five books a week, so he would just shoot through books. I remember How cool. Yeah, we would like hang out. He'd be reading books all the time. A voracious reader. I think he got bored during grad school. Like he did a puzzle like upside down, meaning like the cardboard side, sort to challenge himself. He used to, like hitchhike, I think from grad school, from like Wyoming to Massachusetts. And he'd tell me like, he like, oh yeah. the people you meet is like fascinating. He said once he met this like old sort of leatherface guy. He ended up being like a national rodeo champion in Texas and my dad just conversed with him like the whole trip. How cool. Yeah. All these like really cool things. That's awesome. Yeah, He hiked the Appalachian Trail, which is like 800 miles north to south. I think he was saying, oh, if I could have done it over, I would've done south and north.'cause apparently it's easier going up than down it. So I was like, okay, that's good to know. Yeah. better on the knees. Oh yeah. but he was really, yeah, he just really active person. He just, he got me into if you're gonna do something, do it all the way. You know, like quote unquote live life to its fullest. But he just said, if you're gonna commit to something, like us in jiu jitsu, just, pursue with all the passion, Yeah. Which I think I picked up from him. And then I'm trying to think what else. Oh yeah, he did run for president, but the whole reason he did was, you could run as a lesser known candidate. And, it, his agenda was basically to promote a thorium, which is like an alternative energy source that is like non harm. Like, you know, ecologically friendly. Kelly off Kelly off. Sorry. It's okay. He's in the frame. It's okay. No worries. I love, it's like this, a little head coming up. Yeah, so any, anyway, it's like alternative energy source. It's good for the environment versus carbon, coal, nuclear fission. The whole purpose was to get it out there. And I remember he went to a primary debate in New Hampshire, It was covered by like CNN, so like on somewhere on YouTube, like he's on there with Vermin Supreme. If you ever look up Vermin Supreme, it's like a, a, this personality, joke, what do you call it? Like troll uhhuh. and then what else? He also was featured in Time Magazine for that, for the thorium. Okay. Good promotion. So I think, yeah, just it is just interesting, he thinks big picture about like bettering the world. Yeah. Yeah. He sounds amazing. It's very idealistic. Yeah. Yeah, man. Love to sit down with him and hear some of his stories. Yeah. Yeah. That'd be awesome. Sure. So let's go into your youth and adolescence. Okay. Is there anything else you wanted to touch in the area of, your early years or, I think it was like an angry kid, just, but creative as well. Like I, I did art a lot of, I was speaking into comics and drawing. I remember in high school, I was best dancer. I was the break dancer, all the like, prom, school dances, I dance. I remember I had like a prom date. I was like doing like windmills. I was all sweating. I was like, and they're like, oh, I'm not gonna touch you. I'm not gonna do because you're all sweaty and fair enough. And then, what else? I did, I was a comic. Oh. I was an artist for our school newspaper. Uhhuh. So I actually, kept the clippings of all like the art pieces. Yeah. For like if there's like a front page thing, So definitely it was into drawing and art, those periods. So yeah, it was just fun. I think, looking back at high school, I wouldn't go back, wouldn't change anything. I think I, experienced a lot of, studied hard, had a lot of fun. Did my passions juggled it worked a lot at the same time. And, oh, yeah, that's another thing. I think, not sure if this is just me or just like nature nurture or just it's in my, it's in my core. I always worked, so like I remember my first job,$5 an hour was Baskin Robbins. My first job was Baskin Robbins. did lots of jobs throughout high school and in my early twenties. So Baskin Robbins, Noah Bagel at a Arco Gas station. Nordstrom. What else? There's quite a few others. Is it because you saw your dad as a good example, or do you think it was because, you just wanted some extra money? you just were a hustler? Yeah, My dad's a workaholic, but he never put that on me. I never really saw that or thought about that. I think it was in directly from me. oh, I want it, like I want to buy things. I need to make money for it. And I remember, I got my first, oh, this, that's, this is actually a good story. So very goal driven. Okay, so when I was a junior in high school, there was a kid that was like a senior, or he just graduated. He went to UC, Santa Barbara. He visited our school. He came with a motorcycle to visit a girl or his girlfriend. Nice. And I was like, oh, that motorcycle is so cool. And I, I like, I want one really badly, right? So during the summer I worked four jobs at the same time to get it. So good for you. So I made$5,000 to buy a motorcycle. So when I turned 18, I bought it, before college. And the three months I remember I worked, as a temp at a tech company in Sunnyvale from eight to five. And then from six to 10, I worked at the gas station. So two jobs. Then on the weekend I worked at the skate park. And then I think, there's another job, oh, it was partial during the summer, which was, they paid really well to do janitorial services where it's like you scrape gum off desks, you, you scrub the toilets, but they paid really well. Yeah. It was like, yeah. 20 an hour, but back in 90, 90 nines, which is that's really good. Good. Yeah. That's good money. Yeah. So I worked like four jobs throughout summer. And I was, I remember it was like from eight, maybe even earlier,'cause of the janitor thing, but it was like from eight to 10:00 PM every day. But I saved it and so it was like very goal driven. Yeah. I want a motorcycle. I'm gonna save the money for it. Yeah. You're gonna get it. Yeah. Yeah. That's great. That's a good story. Yeah. Okay. Were there any defining moments in your childhood or teenage years that stick with you today? I'd say, oh, something that stood out is, my dad said I have a sense of justice. And, I noticed that when I got into fights, usually it was like, it's like I stood up the bullies and that was interesting because the kid had called me like a gook or a flat face. You know, like I got me angry and I fought back, or I said, you can't talk to people that way. So to that point, another one was, some friend of mine, like he's beating out loud music like at night, like near a friend's house or something. Or like his girlfriend or something. And the older brother. went outside and said like you're disrespecting, the neighborhood and the noise. And basically they got in an argument and led to a fight where they're like, we'll meet at the library parking lot at this time. And basically like it's our crew of friends and that guy, and I remember like when they were walking to the grass area of the parking lot, the guy sucker punched my friend, oh no. And I was like, oh. So right away I ran up, I punched the guy. I didn't like hit the ground like hit, him in the stomach a few times. But it was like the same sense of like a cheap shot. Hey, you can't do that. And kind of, I guess, I don't know, punishing him, it was like out of a little bit of anger. Yeah. So the sense of justice thing stood out.'cause my dad said like that stood out. And then, I guess here's that thing from childhood that like, my take on that and my lesson is that there are bullies in the world and like they'll get away with it with a good amount of people. But my logic or my thought is that a bully can do it to 10 people or nine out the 10 people. But there's always gonna be that one person that's gonna stand up. Right. Or like put them in their place. And I always thought like, not that it's me, but that's sort of a the karmic way the world works where it's there's balance. Absolutely. Yeah. So that, so I dunno if that answered your question on the childhood thing, yeah. That's something that you carry over. Exactly. Perfect. Okay. So since we were talking about bullying off camera, you mentioned experiencing bullying. How did that affect your identity and how you handle conflict? Yeah, so I think, part of it's like adolescence and, hormones and all that stuff, navigating that when I was younger, I actually remember in college, I actually got arrested. I was on my bicycle and some lady tried to merge in the lane and it's like she cut me off and she almost ran me off the road, honestly. Oh, no. Like she was honking. It was just the road rage thing. But doesn't excuse what I did. Eye for an eye or hate begets hate. I actually sped and caught up to her the red light, and I was like shouting at her. It's you crazy, like blah, blah, blah. are you stupid? You almost hit me. And I, I banged on her window. And then so she, after the light, she pulled into like a. Like a strip mall and then call the police. And I was like, it's fine, I'll wait here and I'll tell my story. Because the police came and, she was the one who called, like that by default, I'm the suspect and she's the victim. and what I mean is if I called first, it would've been reversed. Right. It would've started that way. But basically, I got a misdemeanor charge, disturbing the peace, got mandated, even though it was a cop, but it was still a lesser offense. And it's all in the records or actually it got expunged. I think it was'cause I was like. 17, like 18 or something. It was like right before college. Anyways, it got expunged, but like court mandated anger management. And I guess here's my point. When I went to anger management, everyone shared this story. here's why I'm here's what I need to work on. Uhhuh. I heard stories and crazy stories of why people there. There was like a gang member was like, yeah, I stabbed someone. Like blah, blah, blah, not my proudest moment. And I was like, I thought like I was like, wow, my thing is like just road rage, right? And then one of'em was a flight nurse where they were like a helicopter and there was like turbulence and it shifted and then their elbow hit the patient and the patient thought I was on purpose. Oh. And the flight nurse is I don't even know why I'm here. This wasn't on purpose, it was just like turbulence. And I was like, oh my gosh. And then another one was, there was a woman from domestic violence where and this is the funny thing, and I totally believe her. Like her husband was abusive or hit her, bruises, all that. And the one, and she's always done the thing where it's I don't want trouble. You She wouldn't start it. She wouldn't. Yeah. And she, wouldn't really pursue it or she'd downplay it. The one time that she like pushes back and hits him or throws something, says like puts out on the boundary. She calls the cops on her and then she gets arrested. Wow. that's a jerk move. Yeah, it is and it's I really believe these people. Then there were ones that were like real, like they're just, like they've like the gang member. It's like it's a straight up anger issue. I think it made me realize, over time as I got older, probably like past 26 or 27, I realized like I actually don't really have an anger problem or I learned how to navigate it, so I don't really get angry anymore. But at the time, I think it was just like youth or being in my twenties, yeah. I had a hot head. I like everything personal. Like after that, at some point I like matured. And then also there are times like, like there's workplace bullies where there are probably times where I probably should have set a boundary or sat someone aside and said, you, you can't behave like that. Or, that was inappropriate what you did, and I didn't. Like I allowed it. And that's also, it's almost like a flip where I used to call people out on their bullying or bad behavior. And I remember there's like a woman in HR that was she's definitely a bully. She played mind games with people. She exerted her power. Sounds terrible. Yeah. oh. She's very manipulative. And the funny thing is she was like that for me and I should have called her out on it. And they didn't. Yeah.'cause I was more like, corporate world. I just wanna be a good worker. Don't wanna Yeah. Go with the flow. Exactly. You have to play the corporate game. Yeah. So you're right. In that case, like I was like, I was playing the game too much where I probably should've and then other coworkers felt the same But then there's like a coworker someone that worked with me, and then she called her out on the behavior. Like she filed a complaint. Good. Yeah. So, you know, it's one of those things where I think the older I got, I think I lost that because it's like you don't want to cause waves. You just want to do a good job, get your work done, and get the heck out there. You don't want, yeah. You get it. Yeah, I do. Yeah. I've had situations where I've had to navigate like that. Yeah. Yeah. What drew you into sports and break dancing as a kid? Was that your escape or more about expression? Oh, very good question. fully expression, I think, I'm a very active person. I did track in high school, I think, my dad got me into beat like performance, which is trying to improve myself. So I really got into running. There was periods in middle school where I was like overweight, like a slouch. Break dancing. It's amazing. I think it's just like very creative. I still think how break dancing helps with jiu jitsu. Because it's very similar. It's like combination of moves. It's understanding your body, think of like the word baron, bolo or like, Imanari roll, things like that. it's creation. it's like creatively figuring out how to manipulate your body with another body to achieve a goal. So I think, there's overlap with that. But break dance is like a true expression of how, like how you express yourself with others. Versus jiu jitsu, it's the goals, like points or submission. Dancing has, it can be evaluated. There are dancing competitions. At the same time though, there's such a free form to it and people really appreciate it. It can be judgmental as well where people are like evaluating how good you are or how creative you are. At the same time though, it's a very supportive community where, people are always fascinated with what people create. Because if you think about it, if there's a break dancing competition like in a month. Everyone's preparing for it, just like a jiu jitsu competition, right? They're like refining their moves. They're creating a set of moves. They're just, you know, refining the craft. Yeah. I think, expression wise, yeah, I love it. I do miss it, but being older, it's harder to do that stuff. Yeah. but I think you were mentioning like, if I to win, I'll usually do a little break dance show. Yeah. Yeah. That's awesome. Yeah. When you were break dancing, where would you go for competition? Street? would you be in the dance club? Where would you go? So there's dance practice in different parts of the Bay Area there's like a community center. There's one in San Jose, Hank Lopez that I would go to sometimes, but, I think there was some spots also in San Francisco I used to go to, like in mission, I dunno if it's still around. And, yeah, it's fine. It's just like a, you'll get 30, 40 people there in a rec center. They'll like music playing and just people have their little spots where they just practice. It's like jiu jitsu open mat, right? Yeah. like someone here on this side, someone there on that side. And, yeah, and it's good therapy, like jiu jitsu. Oh, I bet. Yeah. Yeah, it looks amazing. It looks fun. Yep. Let's get into your education and career path area. You studied neurobiology at UC, Davis. What initially drew you to medicine? I think I, had an overachiever mindset. I wanted to be a doctor. in high school I had pretty good grades, not like a 4.0. I think I had a three point, 3.6 or something like that. But also if you go pre-med or if you go med school Doctor route, like a lot of those people have 4.0. It's like they're incredibly smart. It's like the cream of the crop. So that was the idea. Like I wanted to be a doctor, I wanted to be a neurosurgeon. Probably like too ambitious. But that's what I wanted to do. But when I went to Davis, like neurobiology was pretty hard actually. I remember, I studied to the point where I didn't party at all in college. Like I had a toothbrush, a pillow. I used to like, sleep in the library. So I'd spend like a ton of hours there. Had a pretty busy schedule, as a college student. Yeah. So looking back, like kind of wish I had more fun, did more social activities. But honestly, it was just pursuing a goal. Yeah. Yeah. You had to like career wise. Yeah. Yeah. Not room for play. Yeah. You've worn a lot of hats, clinical research, law enforcement, corporate life. What role surprised you the most about yourself? So the police one was like, it doesn't match my personality, but I did find that, something did stand out about that. This is like back in 2008. So I went to San Jose Police Academy and we had 55 recruits. I forgot how it happened, if like people volunteered or like they nominate but I was elected class president of the recruits and we lost a few because they failed out or whatever. I guess case in point, that was my first, experience of leadership, which is like, I'm in a position where it's like, with, the team leaders and hierarchy system of helping manage a group succeed Within like the six month academy. Okay. it taught a lot about like, how to work with people. We had personalities, we had, people that kind of clashed, recruit wise, and you see all different type of personalities. People that are like, wanna help out people that only look out for themselves. But it was an interesting dynamic to understand okay, like my goal is to help everyone succeed and you can't please everyone. And it's also how do I contribute in a way that, like works best with everyone and it's hard.'Cause you wanna let people do their things, but then there are times you want to help people course correct. I felt really lucky because, there were a few individuals that were like really helpful. Some tenured people were. I think there was someone in the Army that was like a Master Sergeant, Mike Milky. I was really close with him. He helped out a lot.'cause he's like an older figure. Yeah. That has been around the corner. Then interestingly, we had a Green Beret. We had someone from West Point, and if anyone knows West Point, like really disciplined people. Yes. So we had a few people from the military side that were like incredibly sharp and talented. Which is odd because I really don't even know if, remember how I got elected as class president. But I think about that a lot because, I think there are certain traits of mine that are leadership driven. The leadership topic kind of carried over where like I was, co-president of the Adoptee Association for San Francisco, representative of the International Korean Adoptee Association. Another topic we didn't talk about in the outline is I went to Africa and volunteered like in 2006, came back from my experience. I networked, there are other volunteers. They're all doctors now. We actually started a 5 0 1 C3 nonprofit international that basically has like a chapter in Denmark, in the United Kingdom in the US. I'm like far displaced from all this stuff. Like I don't do it anymore. They're more active with the organization. Um, but it, you know, it's like me trying to think back, where did this come from? Is this influenced by my father? My father he's like one of the original a hundred people at Adobe. He founded another company after, a small tech company. He's retired now. But the funny thing is I never really observed him. I was never like, oh, he did this, so I wanna do this. I think this is more self-driven. Yeah. Yeah, it's a chicken egg. I'm really not sure where it comes from but there is some sort of drive, or it could be a controlling factor. So here's another weird thing. They do the child development reports, as I'm adopted or throughout the years. And in the evaluation it said Nick's very controlling. So like it wasn't in a negative way. It was almost like, there's some report where the evaluators like Nick on the playground, likes to gather all the children in this sandbox area and have'em play with each other. So it wasn't bad controlling, it was like. Oh, you go here, you go here. And they're like, we'll all play. Yeah. But they observe that and a good structure. Yeah. Like facilitating or getting people together. So, um, from those work professional experiences, something about the leadership side stood out. Yeah, I think that, I still am trying to figure out how to quantify it because leadership's sort of a cloke, it's like a loaded word, like what's a leader, like everyone's a leader, all that stuff. I do feel like I have a skill of bringing people together, networking in a certain way. That's why, we threw an event called Kale Finisher, where it's like event promotion? Like a tournament. And, 50 volunteers all the planning, the event. So we did one in San Francisco, it was like 150 competitors. We did black, brown belt, super fights, lot of local people. We had prize money. We partnered with Shoyoroll. Free gi, so like some of the absolute winners, all that stuff. We did one in Anaheim, California. And we partnered with, hip Hop Chess Federation, Adisa. Oh, and Adisa had his own chess tournament there that had some actors in Hollywood. I'd have to look up the names again. Then Rizza was in it. from, Wu-Tang. All right. Yeah. Cool. I'll send you photos of the footage. Yeah, that'd be cool. So the work thing, I'd say. What did I pick up from that? The police was a leadership thing. I did consulting for six years. I used to go to a different state every other week. I remember I worked downtown San Francisco, this is like 2011 to 2015, 16. This is how I knew I was overworked and I was, a workaholic is I'd be working downtown like Friday nights. And like my light was only light on in sf. Right. While everyone's Out Like partying or having dinner. And I remember my boss, oh, here's a corporate card. Go get sushi for dinner'cause you're gonna work late. And I was like, and also it was like, I normalized it. I was like, oh, okay. I work a lot. No big deal. When as a consultant was working like 60, 70 hours a week, we work until 2:00 AM like certain, like consecutive days. Yeah. And just like for like spreadsheets and projects. The thing that's really good about that is it's paid off. I remember I'd be juggling like 10, 15 clients. Like at a given time, deliverables, statement of works, all that stuff. Bringing money to the company. but it helped my Rolodex, so I actually had a director position for a past client because they remember me. And it was the easiest interview ever. I remember that.'cause I worked with them. So usually, did interviews where it was like five interviews in a row. It'd be like, like half a day at the company headquarters, like Stryker. Where it's just like an hour after hour of panel interviews. And then I remember Stryker,'cause that was the longest one I ever did. It was like dinner at a steak restaurant with the VP of commercial operations or whatever. And what also was funny is like he was expecting like Nick Greene to be like a white guy. Yeah. So like when we had dinner, he's just like, it was like the blandest, it's like a bad dinner date. It's like when he kind of met me, huge disinterest in me. Wow. Which is sad. It is very sad.'cause I had great interviews throughout every single team, like research, regulatory, there's oh yeah, great. Yeah, team player. That was really disappointing. So when I got the con, I got, he is lost. His loss. Yeah, I guess his loss. But when I got the director position for, a past client, basically the VP called me. He was like, when can you start? Nice. Because they already validated through, consulting. Yeah, of course. Yeah. So the networking thing, I think is another strong thing. And I think you see that too, because I'm like, oh, you're in San Francisco. Try and meet whoever you can. Yeah. There's people that would be great for your podcast. So I think I'm wired a certain way to think like that. Yeah. Absolutely. Yeah. Make it happen. Yeah, exactly. Okay, sounds good. Okay, you talked about, being a police officer, earlier. Yep. What led you to that decision and why did you eventually step away? Yeah. what's funny is, I think I needed a career change. I was doing clinical research. It's really like ad nauseum, like you're just doing the same thing and it's like too dry and data-driven. So I think I got tired of it as I need to do something different. And my father, It was like he did a Citizens Police academy. He's do you wanna do it with me? He's sure, I'll do something different. It was like, really? Literally? Like friends, Hey, I'm gonna Vegas, you wanna come? Sure. I'll come. So I did it with him and I was like, Hey, maybe I need to do something different, like public service. yeah, like I'm doing something where I'm like in a little cup cubicle at UCSF. My brain's rotting, so let me do something where it's like person to person, hospitable. So yeah, I did the police academy and the citizens one, and then I applied to be police, and then I went from there, FTO, all that stuff. And then when I went on the field, I think, okay, so this is what stood out. It really wears at you and affects you personally, It really takes a toll on your mental health because I noticed, and here's examples. One is I have a pretty diverse set of friends, different ethnicities. Like one of my best friends in high school, Steve Black bucket, right? I noticed it starts putting on this lens of racism and prejudice where it's like, if you're pulling most frequently black and Hispanic people over right? You start to get a really bad bias to them. So you get this old school like, it's like an old cranky man, black people, they're probably stealing, Yeah. it's really terrible. Yeah. and I'm glad that you saw that and you could admit it. Yeah. It's real because I noticed. I have friends that are different ethnicities, but I just feel this sort of bias, it's like this blanketed, like broad paintbrush of black people are more like, they're probably gonna lie to me they're probably plotting against me. Which is really terrible. Then also all the stress. I noticed I was drinking a lot after work and it was like affecting my marriage. Okay. and we divorced, but that's not why there's other things involved. But I just remember it got to the point where even my ex-wife was like, this is harsh. This is like hard on you. And she didn't, she wasn't happy to see me become more and more of a negative person. And I just give you examples, like I only did it like two and a half, three years, but even under that short period of time, so homeless guy got beat up. We went to their, call all that, and the sergeant's oh, double glove up. And I'm like, why? He's like drunk in public or whatever. Yeah. When I arrest him, he's all bleeding, he like, tries to spit on me. Oh no. And basically the sergeant's, like he is, HIV right? So he's tried to infect me with HIV. And I'm just like, dude, I'm just like, I haven't done anything to him. And that's like an example. I didn't wake up today thinking like, hey, some person with HIV is trying to infect me. You know, there's other stuff like that and it compounds, it's It just wears on you. Yeah. So when I got out of it, I actually noticed, it helped me restore myself to like my normal self. Okay. I remember there was, a pedophile case I did that was pretty crazy. And I went with the DA, we went to Santa Clara County where it's like a 11-year-old boy. And some, therapist was in this picture, where did he touch you? And the doll and all this stuff. And you're like, wow, people are really, there's some really bad people out there. There are, it was his uncle. But it was just, it was hard. Yeah, but it also taught me a lot about people. I think that it helped me really understand people. But then when I had time to get away from it and really reflect on it, I actually noticed some very interesting traits about people like, Some of the most respectful, earnest people, and honest, in a little bit way honest, more honest people were people with like criminal records and people that just, you know, like that lower rung of society. And I'll give you an example.'cause I always to say it is one thing to give an example is another, So I remember, I pulled this guy over, he's like a, he's like a OG oldtimer, like probably norteno or something, like tats everywhere, all that. Yeah. Looked at his record, like he was in the shoe, if you know Some people know In prison. Uhhuh. Yeah. He was in the shoe, his record was like assault, bank robbery, just like stolen car, all that stuff. But he was institutionalized, but also he was really, actually really respectful. I kept my distance, but at the same time, like he was like, yes sir. No sir. And I could tell that his bad days are passing, right. He just wants to live his life. And I remember, there was this like older white guy, like rich guy. He like drove through two red lights or something like in front of me. I was all right, like now I have to pull him over. So I pulled him over. When he pulled him over, he like storms out the car. He says like, how dare you pull me over? Oh no. You know, it's like entitlement. Yes. Yeah. So to me it's I'm just weighing these experiences in my mind, like the entitlement, like how dare you? Like I pay your taxes, blah, blah, blah. And versus yes or no, sir. So it just, yeah, you see different things in society when you know, you wouldn't expect, and Yeah, sometimes you kinda have to like, take away the bias or, which is hard. It's really hard. Oh, yeah. Because you also have to be on guard too, because you just never know. It's both. Yeah. Yeah. But all the time, right? Yeah. No matter who it is. Yeah. it's always on. That's the thing. Like I did the whole ex-wife's oh yeah, you're facing the door and the restaurant, and like you're like looking at where people's hands are. I don't know. yeah. Yeah. It's a tough job. I really, I still keep in touch with friends and, And I feel for them. I also remember I left as a police officer just when it was starting to get really bad. So it was right around the time that Oscar Grant happened, which is Fruitvale Station in the bart, where a cop shot Oscar Grant versus getting the taser out. Okay. So like the whole Oakland community was like angry mob. So that happened right around the time I was about to leave. And I remember everyone started changing their view of police. People used to be oh, police are here to help. They're here to help our community. After that incident, everything went to acab, all that stuff. I remember, like I drive certain neighborhoods, people would spit at me. Not on me, but just sort of like disrespect. Yeah. And I remember another one where it's like people are anti-police. Where apparently there was like some gang people like paintballing and hitting stuff like bats with can just like all that stuff in the neighborhood. And we pulled them over on like a main road like El Camino and, You know, like guns out. I had to do the driver, put your keys out, hands up, walk slowly towards me, blah, blah, blah. I remember that one of them spun around on me and I didn't know if they had a gun or a knife. I was like, holy shit. Yeah. And me and my, sergeant, we grabbed him and slammed him on the ground. And it was just like, oh, It's exciting. And cuffed him all that. But what I remember is there was some like middle class person with a camera phone being I'm gonna report you for abuse, yeah. I was like, in my mind I'm Like you didn't see this guy just like spitting around on me and try and do something to me Uhhuh. But they, but case in point, they were just like, oh, police being, bad police. It's just interesting'cause it just got worse and worse over time. And the friends of mine are still officers that I feel for them. Yeah. I dunno how they do it. I know a lot of our like departments are running really lean, people are like leaving their jobs on it. Quitting. But it's tough. Yeah. I feel for them. Yeah. Yeah. How did your career path shape your identity outside of jiu jitsu? I'd say, I've been told I'm an extrovert. I think I am an ambivert. Introverted and extroverted, but I think, it makes sense what type of job I have now. I'm in big pharma, like I'm a field rep in market access. So I work with sales reps. I see accounts, I guess given my extroverted side, it does align with going to doctors. Staff, promoting things or, helping with like patient cases. So yeah, I think it, it matches well and I do like my industry. I like what I do. Okay. yeah, identity wise, more on the extroverted. You know who I am. Okay. Let's go into personal growth and relationships. You've gone through big relationships, shifts. 17 year marriage and engagement. What have you learned about yourself through love and loss? I'd say it's iterative process. I think I'm more in a normal state where I could speak to this topic and it's not like I'm still hurt. Or I still damaged, right?'Cause there definitely is long-term relationships and breaking up, like people say it's like almost like a death. It's like there's a lot of, recovery from that. I reflect on it a lot. Did a lot of work on it. Not in a rush to be in a relationship again. And also I think like back on the 17 year relationship, like my ex-wife and I, were still friends. Like we still talk here and there, just, check in on each other. Yeah, that's great. Because like we, we were in a relationship from 18 years old to 30, 36 or 37 or something. Yeah. that's huge. That's a long time. Yeah. Couple of decades. Yeah. Yeah. From 18 when we were like teens to then she had like endometriosis, she helped me get through the academy or the police, like our families are really close. It's kinda like you put all that work, like you've gone through so much and you've grown together, you're in different paths in life, so why throw that away? That's how I think of it. And, she's a good person. I'd say that as well. Just didn't work over time because I think relationships ultimately are pretty hard. Honestly, um, love and loss. So yeah, I guess it's on the topic of loss. I think, spending like a lot of time by myself has been really helpful to really just understand how to be at peace and happy in my life. Yeah. If anyone's read on, books actually on codependency if you read it, and attachment styles where like we tend to like, there's healthy attachment styles and unhealthy attachment styles, and it's like you have to really understand like where you are with attachment. It's helped me do the work and really better understand that. So these days I'm not really looking for anything. If something happens, it's great. Yeah. I think before I was trying to fill a void, right? So like my ex-girlfriend after my ex-wife was like, it was like a rebound. Right where I talked to a few friends who're like, you should have just spent a year off just working on yourself. Yeah. And then another funny thing is like my friend, another good friend of mine, these are like really close friends that like gone through divorce. They're like, oh, how are you doing, Nick? Oh, I'm good. And they're like. So 17 years, right? I'm like, yeah. So it's been two years or a year and a half. I'm like, yeah. I feel better. I feel like I've gotten over the hump and I'm like, back to normal. Yeah. He's like, you sure? And he's done a lot of therapy. He's yeah, Nick, like this stuff is like, recovery time is different for everyone. He's just making the point, like it sometimes it really takes time to really get back to your true self or back to being grounded. And that was interesting'cause he was right. Like it, like I think, we broke up at 37, 38, and I'm 43, so five years. Yeah. And, when I was like one and a half, two years when I thought I was good, I really wasn't. I was like drinking, just like partying, doing a lot of things to escape. Or I thought I was good, but then. I was like, what I think versus what I'm doing is different. It's still iterative process. Yeah. It's like putting oil in the car. Like the car is always gonna need oil. It's not like I just drive and it's gonna be fine forever. Yeah. Yeah. It takes a lot of work. It does. Yeah. Okay, so let's go back to the adoption. What prompted you to explore your adoption and Korean roots during the pandemic? Yeah, let's talk about that in depth. Sure. Yeah. Actually, I had no interest in Korean culture, Korean language, any of that stuff. During pandemic I feel like a lot of people did lots of different things. I even talked to friends who like joined jiu jitsu during pandemic'cause oh, I wanna do something different in this pandemic. Yeah. Actually, me and another wave of Korean adoptees, we joined at the same time'cause of the same pandemic prompt. And, we just, got involved with the community, went to events. There's, a Korea gathering in Korea every three years where, adoptees throughout the globe, meet up there. So in 2023 I went to that, it was like 500, adopt 450, 500 adoptees from like Sweden, France. Australia. It's like, Italian Guidos, like they're adoptees from Italy, Uhhuh, and it's almost like they look like Goodfellas. Yeah. They're like long hair. Hey, what's your name? Nice to me. It's insane. Wow. Yeah. They're French ones that have very French personality. Yeah. So that's fascinating. So anyways, yeah. It prompted me to explore something different. And then, I got deeply involved with the adoptee community. It's kind of tapered down because it's like, it's just like you have to explore something, you have to understand it, and then once you get what you need from it, you can continue it or it kind of covers an area that you're curious about. And then you get what you get out of it. So moving to Korea was like a part of that, where there actually were a lot of adoptees that moved to Korea just to experience it. To understand it. Yeah. I don't where you came from. Yeah. Yeah. it's odd because, I don't know if there's any similarities like Native American roots where it's like, you culturally, I feel like I've seen like events where they like have Native American gatherings. They do, like at Stanford, like on the grounds there. Yeah. They just had one recently. Yeah. Yeah. So I saw that once. Yeah. Like years ago. Where it's like you just explore something about your culture just to understand it. Yeah. Yeah. So that's the what, the parallel what you do. Yeah. Yeah. Simple that. Okay. Yeah. So then, what was your experience in Korea? Oh, Korea was, it was good. It was a really good chapter in my life. Cost of living stood out. Like America, we pay way too much for things here across the board. So my apartment in San Francisco was like 2,400, like for a small apartment. The apartment in Korea was one fourth. The price, it was like 700 a month in the center of Seoul Uhhuh, which is like being in New York City in the center of New York City. And it was one fourth, the cost, meals in Korea was like 78 bucks. You can get like a decent meal and then it's like you go to McDonald's here, like Uber Eats, it's 18,$20 for extra value meal. It is. Which is insane. Yeah. So money goes In other countries, it's the same, like dollar goes way further. But then also like America, the salary ranges really can go like really high to low, but it's more lower in Korea. Okay. When I was there, I spent a year there. I taught English during the day. I took Korean language class at night at a university. I was working on learning the language. And then if you're from America, typically most jobs is really just English teaching. It was great. The kids were wonderful. I taught second to sixth grade. The kids were also refreshing.'Cause you know, like I'm from corporate, inner corporate, so it was really nice just to have like fun kids that are curious about you. Really creative, really playful, really curious, fun. Yeah. Like they're a big highlight on my Instagram there's photos of like me and them. Yeah. I saw. Yeah. And it was just nice. It was really like, it restored humanity and oh, people are good. Yeah. These kids are really sweet. They drew little cards, like, teacher, you're the best. Blah, blah, blah. Like little art. Yeah. Yeah. And that was nice. It was just like, good intention people and really sweet kids. So there's that, uh, Korean's a very hard language and I studied Japanese for like middle school, high school and college. And I went to high school in Japan. Like I spent like a four month program, in a high school there. So my Japanese is pretty much fluent. The reason bringing it up Korean language is like incredibly hard. Japanese is considered hard, but even Korean, I was like, I just didn't think I was grasping male like I did other languages. Yeah. It was a lot tougher. Yeah. Honestly. One thing I wanted to know, when you went back to Korea, were you fulfilled on what you were looking for? Yeah, that's, you know what's funny? A lot of adoptees ask me the same exact question as you. I think I got what I needed out of it. Just experience what it's to live there, what it's like to be a Korean, and they're very kind people. It's like other countries where it's like they've gone through a lot. There's been the Korean War. Japanese occupation. And that can be tough, like that, scarring and trauma but there is like a very hospitable, caringness to them. And like my neighbor taught me how to make Korean pancakes. The landlord lady was like a mother. She like, Korean New Year she would give me like pastries. Oh, that's sweet. And then she'd drop off kimchi every few months. So that was really nice. It was like Sesame Street or like Mr. Rogers neighborhood. There's a flower lady I talked to. There's a lady made Kimbop, which is like a Korean sushi roll. So it's like I, I had a routine where I'd bring Kaui there. Yeah. She pet Kaui. I buy a roll. So you formed your own community? Yeah. I'd say that. Or the community helped me integrate. Yeah. That's awesome. Yeah, so it, it made it pleasant'cause you could basically say hi to your neighbors and it helped me practice my korean a little bit, but That's nice. When you were in Korea, did it bring you any answers or even more questions? I think it brought more answers,'cause I just wanted to experience and understand it. Yeah. And, like living there, did it. I think if I didn't live there, I'd have more questions. But having to immerse yourself, live as one, it gave me an experience. Good. Yeah. To understand it. That's great. Now we're gonna go into your jiu jitsu journey. Okay. Yeah. I was at an event called Fight to Win, and so I went over there to take some photos of team daruma, which is Alberto. And as I was taking photos of these different matches, until his came up and all of a sudden you came up and the only reason it stuck to me, in my mind for a long time, it's your energy. It was for one, your jiu jitsu was great because you won your match, and third, you did some break dancing move at the end. So I thought it was pretty awesome and amazing. Yeah. Yeah. So thank you for that, Nick. Oh, you're welcome. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, make coffee. Very entertaining. So let's start this off. Let's talk about jiu jitsu. What do you remember about your very first class and how you got into it? This is a great question. Yeah, that's you should ask everyone that. It's hard to remember the first class, but I remember, a break dance friend of mine was like, we're getting older. It's hard to do break dancing. You should try jiu jitsu. I was like, all right. And my friend Coy, so I was like, where do you train at? Academy Self Defense, Triune Stan Kendrick. I was like, cool. Lemme check it out. I don't know if I went there alone or if I like met up with coy, but I just went in and it was like a nice humble, small class. It was like, I think that's where I met OJ. I dunno if you met oj, right? Uhhuh. He was a brown be at the time. This is like back in oh 8, 0 9, there was Kevin Lee. I don't even know what he's up to. Roger Ver there's a few others. I don't know if Josh was there at the time, but, I think he started at Ralph Gracie, and then he ended up, because he was doing, I think MMA. Okay. And then, he was doing some cage fighting and then he came over to Stan Yeah. At the same place you were at. Yeah. but that time, like he may have joined a little bit later. Yeah, Stan taught, I remember. Stan was influenced by Saulo Ribeiro, from, Six Blades. So Saulo like his influence and Sal's like a good OG instructor. So Stan gave a really good base, so first class I remember like I'm a white belt. I remember, I really liked it like. Like it clicked. Like you get the bug, I call it the jiu jitsu bug, where it just like, all you think about is jiu jitsu. I was really into it and I remember, uh, I have no idea. I know it was spazzy. I remember I was probably like a, like overpowering everything as a white belt. I'll see if I can find some photos like back. Yeah, that would be great. Back in the day. Yeah, because there are like one or two, like me and OJ and others. But it was good. And I think what really made it well is there's some instructors that these days that do like fancy lapel guard and all that stuff, I do appreciate more and like that Stan was really good at fundamental foundational basics, core structural, like good, clean jiu jitsu. And I think like you can always attribute certain things to certain people, I think my chemours are more from him than others. Okay. Yeah. You kind of pick up things that really stand out, like where you got something. But it was fun. Yeah, that was basically my first class, but it was like a small group. It was like maybe. 10 or 12 OJ's Brown. Maybe there's like a purple or blue or two. Okay. it's that kind of ratio. Okay. Yeah. Cool. Okay. You said that you competed, you had a couple of months and then you started to compete and that was very soon in your training. Yep. So can you tell me about what happened there? Yeah, competing. So I got the bug. I wanted to compete. I just enjoyed it'cause the way to describe it is, it's like an adrenaline rush. Obviously there's anxiety and like nervousness and stress, but, when I competed, it was just fun. I just enjoyed the process in general. I always thought that it is like the equivalent of skydiving, people look forward to the weekend to skydive, get their, like their fix and then they train or they go back to work. So I gotten that pattern of just wanting to compete like whenever I can, like once a month or twice a month. So here's a spreadsheet of tracking. If you wanna check it out, you can even show on the camera. Wow. Look at that. Yes. Feel free to scroll. So that's your, okay. This is his, uh, that is a lot of lines and a lot of competing. You did. Yep. That's amazing. Yeah. And I encourage anyone it's worth tracking to like,'cause what it revealed to me is trends, oh, I'm losing my points a lot. Like I'm starting to lose more of my points. I need to work on like positional or it's like I'm getting really close. Like you start to notice, trends in how you compete and then you can fix it. Oh, I got triangled. I can't get triangled. Like, I got Triangled here. I got Triangled here. I really gotta work on like triangle defense. Okay. So anyways, that's to the audience. Okay. Sounds good. So yeah, so you're like trying to narrow in what you need to work on. Yeah. That's good. That's a nice way to keep track of everything. Yeah. I have another friend that usually he just videotapes himself and then he just goes back and watches it. But I think yours is a little bit more statistical and, yeah, we do both. I'll show the footage to like my coach and they'll be like, Hey, what? You know, and they'll tell stuff. I've had students bring their footage to me and I'll be like, oh, if you didn't do this, you probably would've kept out of their guard or something like that. Yeah. That's good. No, that's great. That's a great monitor. So in all that competing, what has stood out to you the most? Yeah. I'd say the really big ones where I really had to earn it and it was a battle. so one of them was, Abu Dhabi trials that are thrown in different parts of the US and then if you win a trip to Abu Dhabi. And then you can compete for like prize money or a belt or both. Yeah. Uhhuh. So when I was Blue belt, like basically you have to win, you have to medal at your weight class. I think it was like middle or medium heavy. And then all the winners fight an absolute, and then it's whoever wins absolute. like the gold there wins the trip. So I did in Las Vegas and I remember, it's actually funny because we ended up being teammates later. The final was me against, his name's Graham and he's like pretty athletic. He's bigger than me. He's really technical too, and I could find the footage for you, basically it was like, I think it was an advantage or a rough decision I won and it was in like the last 30 seconds. And then when I won, this is when I was at Heroes, like I collapsed on the ground, like Gumby and others were like cheering, you won a trip to Abu Dhabi, you did it and screaming. And then I think I was like crying. Oh. So like just, it was like the, it is like the emotional burst, just like I did it all that work Also, all that work that got put into it. Yeah, because you like, you realize, like you sacrifice, weight cutting. like friends going out socially, just pushing, like that hard gradual buildup of like all that investment of time, right? And yeah, like that was one of'em, that stood out. And just to like finally do something where it's like you get to go to the big stage. or you win a trip, right? Yeah. It's just kind of surreal. You're just like, oh, I can't believe I did this. Like it paid off. Yeah. The other is, I won it in Purple Belt in Hawaii, so they did trials in Hawaii, and what stood out there is you know what it was, it's like a flow state. It's like I had a really good day that day. Like I went surfing with, some friends, Like Manny Diaz, who also competed. Nice. Mandy Diaz is actually like a, like an old school legend. I don't know if you've ever heard the name. No, I have not. He comes from Watsonville. Okay. yeah, ask Kiko or, Okay. Mike Kirby or Josh, yeah. Yeah. Manny was in the scene for a while, but then, he got injured. but we went, we traveled. He competed. I competed, I got lucky in won. And then there's another thing where it's like. I like, I dunno if I was crying, but I did the whole ah, like super excited because it's like climbing the mountain, like a huge mountain, like Everest or something. And like you got to the top like, I did it. I can't believe I did it. So that was, that stood out as well. Another one that stood out, I think it's just the fruits of reward, which is I competed so much and put so much work into it. it's nice to be recognized and to get the opportunity was, I did EBI three times. Okay. And the funny thing is how I got into EBI, the first was, I used to travel to LA for work, for accounts. Yeah. And I would drop into downtown LA 10th Planet and Eddie Bravo taught a lot. He actually teaches a lot there. Oh, wow. So Eddie would see me rolling. I don't know if he knew my competition background, but he saw me rolling with his students, and I drop in a few times. And he's Hey, but hey, you're pretty good Bombo. Or, you have some really good skills. we do like to be on EBI. And I was like, of course.'cause EBI huge. Yeah. so yeah, I got to be on that. And then I did two other ones.'cause even though I lost, he invited me back and I thought that was ironic. But also it showed if you win or lose, people do remember you on your skill or like the work that he put in. Yeah. I think that was admirable. Yeah. You probably a good match. And even though you lost you, you still put on a great. Yeah. Performance. Yeah. and those things stand out. It's like the things you think about, like revealing character or like what people, someone's about. Another one was, Benji Silva. I don't know if you know that name. Benji and I had, he's from Caio Terra. Okay. He and I had a really good match in Fight to Win eight, like one of the beginning ones in Kezar Stadium in San Francisco. And it was a really good back and forth and, I did some good slams on him. And the refs gave it to Benji. And here's the interesting thing, because I wouldn't have expected this, so Benji like came to me and he's oh, I wanted to give you the prize money. But I'm like, why are you doing that? Like you won. And basically,'cause his coach is Caio. I think Caio even went up to me and he's Nick, like even though Benji won, I think. I think you won, given like how that, it was interesting. I think it, like what it stood out was, Caio didn't have to do that, but I think his, what's the right word for that? It's like he was standup ish and he's standing up for what he thought was right. Correct. And I thought that was interesting. Okay. Because a lot of coaches be that they would just be like, oh yeah. we'll take the win. That's it. We'll take the win. Exactly. Yeah. And I thought that was like, interesting that he took that sort of moral ground of you really won. Like even though the refs don't agree with that. And that kind of stood out because it meant that Caio was above just like petty winning. It means he actually, it's like standing for real jiu jitsu. Okay. Maybe that was it. Okay. yeah, so that stood out because I wouldn't expect that from him. Yeah. Yeah. That's awesome. Great character. Yeah. You trained under some big names. What lessons are value stuck with you from each instructor? uh, Stan, like I said, I think really good fundamentals, good foundation. Gumby, the same thing. Really good foundation, good fundamentals, really helped with giving me a good, starting point. And then Kurt teaches in a wake. You know what, I was talking to a friend about this. Kurt really understands people and culture, and he creates an environment even though he is a little bit controversial figure, but he creates an environment I think that really made this feel like a good place, like a second home and yeah, Kurt also, he puts everything, he's like really nurturing. But he does it in a way that's like the rebellious, like heavy metal version of it. He cares a lot about his gym and he's kinda like one of us. You know, he doesn't do the hierarchical, like I'm the instructor. He loves what he does. He's very passionate about it. Most of my years were with Kurt. It was like from like blue. I remember the first day I came into this gym, this whole side wasn't here. Yeah, from blue to black belt. So Kurt gave me his black belt when I first got my belt. Which is a huge honor. I rarely wear it. It's more in the shadow box thing. He's such a fascinating guy too. And you know what I feel like I've learned from Kurt, to do it your way because a lot of instructors, they kind of do this sort of vanilla ish, I'm gonna instruct here very formalized, right? Kurt really shared that, you could have fun, you can personalize it, you can add flair to it. So it's not just like this, like TaeKwonDo style instruction of martial arts. And then, here's something on Ralph that I like to share. So, uh, Ralph cares like a lot about his students in the academy. He sees it as a second family. I'm good friends with Ralph, like I've been to his house for his birthday. We did a Tahoe trip with other students together for New Year's Eve. So really spending quality time with him, I gotta see like another side of him. Which is like really warm, really invested in the students. He really sees it as like how much value they bring to him, not just like him to them. Here's something I like to share with people, which is, I remember there was a class in the evening that finished and there was some like leftover white belts on this side, and pretty much everyone was gone, right?'Cause that's the main mat side. Okay? So I peeked over and no one's watching. And Ralph spend 10 or 15 minutes to like, like straight up beginner white belt. helping them like correct their positions or something with close guard. Yeah. But my point is this Ralph, no one was looking at Ralph. He wasn't trying to be shown. It wasn't optics. Like he wants to look good. He just genuinely like, geeked out and wanted to help these white belts learn something. Yeah. And like also in a subtle way. Like you're in a good place. Okay. Like you've decided to join our gym and this is a place where we all help, we all nurture each other. We're all the same. And I think that's really important because creating the right environment is everything. You know, like a safe place sanctuary. Sure.'Cause we did have a little bit of dark days, honestly, like Kurt was great, but then there was another instructor that tarred, tarnished the academy a little bit. I don't wanna go into details and I'm purposely not saying the name. But I'll say this'cause this matters. I remember watching them talk down to a white belt and say what the fuck are you fucking stupid? You don't know how to do the move. I just showed it to you. And we had white belts quit because of that. Yeah. And it really pissed me off and I'll say this publicly on this podcast because the damage it did to some of the students to be treated that way, we still have a lot of students that even still do jiu jitsu, but they're just like, yeah, I remember he talked down to me, he like, dismiss me or whatever and it's like they remember. It's a little bit of a bullying thing subtly. And, we really miss Kurt and we lost a lot of really good students there. But it really frustrated me to see how some of the students were treated. And I'm happy to say that on this podcast. And if people on the other side under the instructor think negatively of me. That's fine. I don't really Yeah. I just do not like that they had that effect on people. Mm-hmm. And people quit because of that. And people just had bad experiences. Like I did not like that at all. Yeah. Yeah. You want everybody to have a safe space Yeah. With the ability to learn and, do their jiu jitsu. Yeah. Which we have now. You know, like the great thing is we created that environment after the sad thing is again, we really miss and we think about Kurt a lot. He was really like close to us. Yeah. And we lost some really good students. Yeah. People like really good training partners. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Unfortunately it happens. Yeah. It's life. Okay. Okay. When we talked earlier, you mentioned that purple belt was your favorite. Why does that belt stand out to you? I So I'd say purple belt, best way to put it. Purple belt's where I really started to expand on truly learning jiu jitsu. Blue belt I felt like I just do top game passing, smashing, just like pressure. Just like certain moves. Purple belt. I'm like really opened up with learning everything like open guard, spider guard, da la riva, and really trying to understand it deeply versus blue it almost felt like I just stuck with one or two things and just master that. So I think the growth potential is like you start to really wanna explore everything in jiu jitsu and also refine it. Ver versus like you'd only go so deep with understanding a move at blue Belt. Okay. How do you define jiu jitsu now as a black belt compared to when you first started? I'd say black belt. When I first started, I think jiu jitsu was all this superficial stuff of trying to tap people out, trying to tap people out, trying to see where I'm at with others. all the honeymoon stuff with it, just, I think black belt's actually taken a step back and thinking more about, like holistic stuff. Just the community stuff. There's a period also when I was black belt where I started like really going back to basics. Like I wasn't thinking about all the fancy moves, but just revisiting, like opening a clothes guard. Very simple, very clean. It's almost like being a white belt again. Okay. The other big thing with black belt, it's the new challenge is like being able to teach jiu jitsu. Because everyone learns differently. You have to explain something where it makes sense to the beginners and also the expert, like the high belts. And that's a challenge because there's a sweet spot. It's almost like a Goldilocks like. You can do too much information and then not enough information, but there's a just right amount so that everyone gets it. I'd say the overall bigger picture of jiu jitsu. in the beginning it's a lot about, what I can get out of it and like how it serves me. So it's like when you're a beginner, everyone's trying to get better. They're just starting on the journey, so they're also trying to figure out what jiu jitsu is. I think over the years you start to. See more and more of, the bigger picture with it. So it's the community is a big one. also how it like, helps people in different facets of their life, like mental health, friendships, just the growth of people around them. So if you're to like open up my mind as a black belt and like look what's inside there. It's a lot of, like outside stuff, not just like with myself, but like seeing how our students do, how they grow. Also we know a lot of the same people, like Josh becoming a coach, right? He was like a blue belt. Last time, when we go way back. I remember like he and I were like blue belt. People have like developed and flourished in their own ways. There's a lot of people wear, I was like, brown belt, they're a white belt and now they have their own academies, which is like a amazing, it's like I would never have thought they like open up their own academy in San Jose or something. Yeah. And also when they're like young and now they're like straight up adults and like east side's. One where he's like a baby. He was like 16, a little Mexican kid, Uhhuh. And now he has his own academy and like students and he's he is got a beard. So to me on the black belt side, I think it's just really fun and fascinating to see growth in different ways. Yeah. and as you can tell, like I'm very community driven or like oriented, so yeah. Yeah. Yeah, I can see that for sure. Yeah. How has jiu jitsu helped you mentally, especially in handling anxiety or life's heavier moments? great question. I would say, it's, when I went through my divorce, it was really hard. I was in a really dark place. I was negative Nick. Ralph being a really good friend, he sat with me and he said jiu jitsu's always gonna be here for you. It wasn't the fancy talk, it was like really direct and straight. But he knew what my situation was. And in a simple way to just come on in and, we're here for you. Yeah. And then the more I trained, like the more, like the negative cloud went away, being around teammates and being around, good aura, good energy really helped. I just noticed it helped me restore myself quicker. And because, I was in my own head space, like I brewed at home or I'd be dark and negative. Yeah. So that really stood out. I think. and Ralph recognized that too. Uhhuh, that was helpful. Yeah. And he was able to help pull you out of that. Yeah. Yeah. That's good. Yeah. Yeah. Good mentors. Yeah. That's what you need. What's one thing Jiu-Jitsu's taught you that has nothing to do with jiu jitsu? Interesting. I think it's the biggest equalizer. So I think, it just creates an environment where it doesn't matter what, like how much you make, what you do for a living, who you are, if you're important or not. But when you're on the mat and when you're like at an open mat or with people, we don't care about any of that. And it's like it breaks everything to the core of just like in like appreciating the moment of training and learning from a partner. And being challenged by partner. Yeah. And that's really nice because like when you get out, when you step outside the academy, everything becomes about like bias and judgment. Like someone will look at oh, what car you drive? Or are you, dress up nice or not? Or what do you do? But when you like go on the other side into the academy, that all goes away. And it's nice. It's like a nice neutrality of just, you know, doing an activity that everyone loves for the same reason. Yep. I agree. You've dropped into gyms all over the country. What makes a truly welcoming academy? Ooh, another good question. I'd say, It doesn't have to be like every academy instructor welcomes you and rolls out the red carpet or students or everyone's shaking and bowing to you. I think it's just you come into a place where, it's almost do what the people do. if you go to another country, like you just go in and it's oh, you're one of us and student. And we're not gonna over overtreat you like you're the guest of honor. But not ignore you either. Uhhuh Actually like for drop-ins, there's someone that dropped in today and they're like, oh, I'm visiting outta town. I picked up on this. one of our purple belts, Daniel was like, oh, they're asking about drop in fees. Like, oh, just go train. We'll, we will worry about that later. And that was nice. Yeah. That was exactly the example. It's like we just make it simple, just train, you're, you do what we do. Yeah. We'll figure out the payment stuff later. Yeah. And it's felt like that when I've dropped into places. Yeah. Yeah. Any places that stand out to you? that you've trained at and trained with some big names. Yeah. it's really fun to see instructors really passionate about jiu jitsu. I remember, when I was like blue or purple, I dropped in into fight sports with Cyborg. Abreu Cyborg. Yeah. I don't even think he knew who he was. Maybe, or maybe just as a visitor. He showed some moves and then like towards the end of the class, he spent five minutes like, oh. Just have to fix this one thing. And he is like doing it hands on with me. Yeah. And I was like, oh, it's like a little mini five minute private. Oh good. But I could tell he really geeks out in jiu jitsu because he's oh, I love this stuff. Lemme just show you this thing so you really know it. Yeah. And I was like, he didn't have to. It was a class of 20 or so. That stood out. Another one stood out is when I was really active Blue belt. I dropped into Drysdale, Roberto Drysdale Academy. The instructor was Sonny Nohara. Like I was really athletic at the time, blue Belt, like really in shape. And Sonny Nohara is like a hundred forty five, a hundred fifty pound black belt. And we rolled, he got me into side control and I couldn't get out the whole time. Wow. And it showed if you have really good control and like base and know how to use your body, it doesn't matter. It kind of taught me size as a factor, but understanding position and technique and weight, like it showed, he held me there the whole time. And he's 150 pounds. I was like one 90. Wow. So I was like that. That was just, yeah. It just made me realize yeah. How did you really use your body's important. Another one is I dropped into Marcella Garcia's. He rolls with everyone, but it's actually more selective or mostly his students. So Paul Schriner teaches there. Paul's an OG from the Bay Area from I think Garth Taylor, or Claudio. So Paul gave the green light to roll Paul said, Nick is okay to roll with.'Cause I'm not trying to like tap Marcello out or prove a point. So it was purple belt I rolled with Marcelo. It's on his website, MG online. It was just to feel what it's like to roll with Marcelo Garcia was like another level because like just his technique it's like learning from a chess master and I'm an amateur, right? Another thing about Marcello Garcia that stands out is okay, and also Dave Camarillo when you roll with them, you understand why they're so good. So whenever roll with Marcello Garcia, if I were to do a scissor sweep and I've told people this. Like it would be like four or five moves to do it. Grab the collar, turn on my body slice, like posture up, and then get on top and it's four or five movements. What makes Marcelos so good is that he can do all those four or five movements in one step. So it's like a bear trap. Everything sets off at once. Yeah. Whereas it's like we have to do incremental steps. So when you watch his footage, you realize like he's doing the same thing. He's just snapping into movements. All chained together. Yeah. and then Dave Camarillo, uh, use of body, what stood out when I roll with him Is that we just do a lot of traditional movement. I don't know if you call it Matrix jiu jitsu, but he knows how to really move the body where it's like different unorthodox ways that you wouldn't think. Oh, okay. Yeah. It's hard to describe. It's just sort of acrobatic a little bit more. versus like just basics, so that stood out as well. Yeah. Awesome. So in closing now, Your dog is a celebrity at academies. Tell me more about him. The one that's been barking. Yeah. I'm a huge dog person. I used to bring my old dog to the academy. Kaui, I think it's a win-win'cause he enjoys people more than dogs. So when I bring him academies, he'll play with the people. People will play with him. he's also a very engaging dog. so yeah, it's, it's fun to bring him here. I don't know if he's the, the gym dog or the academy dog.'cause there's a little dog called Bella. It's a little chihuahua that's like the official, I think, academy dog, but Kaui's a jiu jitsu training companion. Okay. So I like to bring him everywhere I go. Awesome. Yeah. Yeah. He's so cute. Yeah. Outside of jiu jitsu? What's fueling your curiosity these days? So, paragliding is like my white belt sort of interests. I saw someone doing it in Hawaii, in Oahu, and I just was obsessed with wanting to do it. Um, just'cause it just looks like a free art form, just something really nice where you're, you know, like in the sky and free. So I took lessons during COVID, and I even got to do a few flights. The feeling itself is amazing. The way I describe it is, if you go snowboarding or skiing and the chairlift, that when it goes down slowly yes. And you're floating down. it's very similar to that. But, we're spoiled because Pacifica and San Francisco and even Monterey'cause you're from Salinas. Yeah. People paraglide in those areas and on certain days, you can do figure eights and just float for half an hour to an hour. Just gliding along the wind. I'm looking at getting certified. it's really hard. Actually there's a lot of skill sets to learn to get certified and, 2025 goal I wanna learn how to do it so I can get certified and do it on my own. Sounds like fun. you could give your younger nick one piece of advice, what would that be? younger self advice? I would say, enjoy the ride, enjoy the process. I remember when I was like blue or purple belt brown, all I wanted to do was get the next belt, like I competed and wanted to double gold just to. climb the ladder and, like just accomplish things. And once you get the next belt, you know, you can never go back. That's why like when you're blue and purple, it's fun'cause it's just like a, it's a time where you can just like, try stuff fail, no one's judging you. Like once you get the next belt, you can never go back. So just just enjoy it, I'd say. Yeah. Enjoy. Yeah. What would you say to someone brand new to jiu jitsu who's hesitant to take the first step? Yeah. I'd probably learn this from Kurt. It's just jump in there. You know, like a lot of the time the fear anxiety is like self-imposed. And I know the environment's a really good environment. It's very nurturing. People wanna help each other succeed. but I totally get when you see people like trying to strangle each other and sweat on each other, it's intimidating. So I remember there was some student that was like a high belt that they said they walked by the academy like three or four times living in San Francisco until they actually went in. And they said, oh yeah, once they went in and did the class, like I loved it. But I just say, take the leap and I learned that from Kurt's. Yeah, just jump in. Yeah. Yeah. Any final thoughts or things you hope people take away from hearing your story? Yeah, I'd say, um, when you get a chance to give back, it's done a lot for my life and improved my life and enriched it. So I'd say it's a sort of pay forward thing. Okay. Very pay forward. Like whenever you get a chance, contribute back to it. That makes the whole community even more enriched, right? Right. Because just it feeds on itself. Positive on top of positive it compounds. I'd say that, yeah. I think that's the simple gist of it. And then also try everything in jiu jitsu if you can. Or maybe that's just me. There's a reason why I did refereeing, I helped throw events. I did all these things. because, I think by doing that, you really get to see different sides of jiu jitsu, not just as like a competitor or student, but the event promotion side or Kiko or what you do, right? You just, get different viewpoints and it enriches yourself as well. Yeah, I think so too. So would you like to say anything about your dojo? Give some information, where you're at, where you can be found on Instagram. Sure. Yeah. my Instagram is Korean Bomba, Korean, and B-O-M-B-A. Yeah, I'm starting to get back into competing. I'm going to, I sometimes, I don't like to make a big deal of it. I like keep it low key, but, I'm starting to, train more,'cause I'm gonna start getting back into competition. It's been four, like four or five years or so. I registered for Brasileiro Nogi in Rio for end of June. So I'll be in Brazil for 10 days. and then I'm gonna probably do Master Worlds, on top of that. And then, give a shout out to Control Industries. Blaine is a good friend. He's, also saw the earth, like cares about people and he also is from that jiu jitsu world. But he's been my sponsor since I think Brown Belt in 2015. Okay. So Blaine, thanks for what you do and appreciate you, man. All right. Right on. Okay, Nick, I wanna thank you for being on my podcast and I'm looking forward to putting this one out. Thank you so much. Cool. Alright, thanks as well. And we have a little background because we have open mat now, so Yeah, they're itching. Okay, let's do it. Okay, bye. Thanks. Bye.